Legislature(2007 - 2008)SENATE FINANCE 532

03/14/2007 09:30 AM Senate FINANCE


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09:35:43 AM Start
09:35:53 AM Pers Defined Benefit Plan Accounting
10:08:46 AM Adjourn
* first hearing in first committee of referral
+ teleconferenced
= bill was previously heard/scheduled
-- Time Change --
+ Senate Bill: TELECONFERENCED
PERS Cost Share
<Pending Introduction & Referral>
-- Testimony <Invitation Only> --
+ Bills Previously Heard/Scheduled TELECONFERENCED
                            MINUTES                                                                                           
                    SENATE FINANCE COMMITTEE                                                                                  
                         March 14, 2007                                                                                       
                           9:35 a.m.                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
                                                                                                                              
CALL TO ORDER                                                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
Co-Chair  Bert  Stedman  convened the  meeting  at  approximately                                                               
9:35:43 AM.                                                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
PRESENT                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
Senator Lyman Hoffman, Co-Chair                                                                                                 
Senator Bert Stedman, Co-Chair                                                                                                  
Senator Kim Elton                                                                                                               
Senator Donny Olson                                                                                                             
Senator Joe Thomas                                                                                                              
Senator Fred Dyson                                                                                                              
Senator Charlie Huggins                                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
Also Attending:  SENATOR STEVENS; REPRESENTATIVE  HAWKER; ANNETTE                                                             
KREITZER,  Commissioner, Department  of Administration;  CHARLENE                                                               
MORRISON,  Chief Financial  Officer, Division  of Retirement  and                                                               
Benefits, Department of Administration.                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
Attending  via  Teleconference:   There  were  no  teleconference                                                             
participants.                                                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
SUMMARY INFORMATION                                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
^PERS Defined Benefit Plan Accounting                                                                                           
Presentation by Division of Retirement and Benefits                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
9:35:53 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
ANNETTE  KREITZER,  Commissioner, Department  of  Administration,                                                               
gave an introduction to presentations  on the policy goals of two                                                               
bills  that  would  be  introduced   by  Governor  Sarah  Palin's                                                               
Administration in  the coming  weeks. The  first bill  related to                                                               
"technical fixes"  within the Public Employees  Retirement System                                                               
(PERS), pertaining  to death and disability  benefits. The second                                                               
bill  was referred  to as  a "cost  share bill,"  necessitated by                                                               
accounting issues  within PERS.  This presentation  would address                                                               
the accounting concerns.                                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
Ms.  Kreitzer informed  that presentations  would be  on-going to                                                               
"show  the  Committee  each  step  of a  plan  that  starts  with                                                               
shifting to  cost share  plan; how doing  that impacts  the State                                                               
and local  governments' bottom line;  how we can keep  costs down                                                               
for  all of  us and  address the  unfunded liability."  She noted                                                               
that $355  million was currently  included in the FY08  budget to                                                               
fund  State employees'  pension costs,  and that  figure did  not                                                               
include pension  costs for the  University, the  legislature, the                                                               
Alaska Court System or the Alaska Marine Highway System.                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
9:39:07 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
CHARLENE   MORRISON,  Chief   Financial   Officer,  Division   of                                                               
Retirement and Benefits, Department  of Administration, began her                                                               
presentation which  was accompanied by a  handout titled, "Public                                                               
Employees' Retirement  System (PERS), Defined Benefit  (DB) Plan,                                                               
Accounting  Issues,  Senate Finance,  March  14,  2007" [copy  on                                                               
file].                                                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
AT EASE 9:39:39 AM/9:41:07 AM                                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
9:41:13 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
     Page 2                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
     Why are we here today?                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
        ™Concerns about employer level accounting for the PERS                                                                 
          DB plan.                                                                                                              
        ™Contribution rates for PERS DB plan not supported by                                                                  
          employer level accounting records.                                                                                    
       ™Set the stage to discuss the proposed solution.                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
Ms. Morrison reviewed the page.                                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
9:41:43 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
     Page 3                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
     Proposed Solution                                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
          Cost share legislation                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
             ™Administer the PERS DB plan like the TRS DB plan                                                                 
             ™State to assume 65% of unfunded liability at                                                                     
               6/30/2006 (estimated $3.6B of $5.5B total)                                                                       
             ™All   employers   share    the   cost   (benefits,                                                               
               administration and investment)                                                                                   
             ™Simplify administration                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
Ms. Morrison overviewed the page, adding that the unfunded                                                                      
liability is not yet known for June 30, 2006.                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
9:42:45 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
     Page 4                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
     Proposed Solution (cont.)                                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
          Address the unfunded liability                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
             ™If market conditions warrant, use pension                                                                        
               obligation bonds as part of solution to reduce                                                                   
               the unfunded liability.                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
Ms. Morrison summarized the page.                                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
9:43:03 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
     Page 5                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
     PERS = One System but Two Plans                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
             ™Defined Benefit Plan (Tiers I, II, and III)                                                                      
             ™Defined Contribution Retirement Plan (Tier IV)                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
Ms. Morrison read the page, referring to the Defined                                                                            
Contribution Retirement Plan as the "hybrid plan".                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
9:43:44 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
     Page 6                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
     PERS DB Accounting Issues                                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
     No impact on:                                                                                                              
        ™Teachers' Retirement System (TRS)                                                                                     
        ™Benefits paid to members                                                                                              
       ™PERS DB Plan level accounting (PERS as a whole)                                                                        
        ™New PERS Defined Contribution Retirement Plan (Tier                                                                   
          IV)                                                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
Ms. Morrison reviewed the page. She noted that many "pieces" of                                                                 
the PERS Defined Benefit (DB) issues had been studied throughout                                                                
the State, but she would focus on two primary issues.                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
9:44:29 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
     Page 7                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
     Agent Multiple Employer Plan                                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
     Defined and described as follows:                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
             A plan that provides benefits to employees of more                                                                 
             than one employer                                                                                                  
               ™Pooled administrative and investment functions                                                                 
               ™Share costs/income of pooled functions                                                                         
               ™Separate accounts for each employer                                                                            
               ™Each employer's contributions are to provide                                                                   
                  benefits only for that employer's employees                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
Ms. Morrison overviewed the information.                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
9:45:07 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
     Page 8                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
     Alaska Statutes                                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
     AS 39.35.100(b)(3)                                                                                                         
        ™A separate account for each employer shall be                                                                         
          maintained.                                                                                                           
        ™The account shall be credited with contributions of                                                                   
          the employer.                                                                                                         
        ™This account shall be charged with the employer's                                                                     
          actuarial charge for pension, death benefits, and                                                                     
          other benefits paid under this plan to or on behalf of                                                                
          the employee of the employer.                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
Ms. Morrison reviewed the page, adding that although the Alaska                                                                 
statutes do not use the term "multiple employer plan," they                                                                     
require many of the same components.                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
9:45:51 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
     Page 9                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
     Alaska Statutes (cont'd)                                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
        ™AS 39.35.680 (22) defines employee as "…a retired                                                                     
          member…"                                                                                                              
        ™AS 39.35.250 states that the past service portion of                                                                  
          the employer's contribution rate is that "required to                                                                 
          amortize the unfunded obligations of the employer…"                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
Ms. Morrison read the page.                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
9:46:12 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
     Page 10                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
     PERS DB Plan                                                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
     [Flow chart showing the following:                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
     Assets                                                                                                                     
          Investment Income                                                                                                     
          Contributions                                                                                                         
               DB Employee                                                                                                      
               DB Participating Employer                                                                                        
     Minus                                                                                                                      
     Liabilities                                                                                                                
          Pension Benefits                                                                                                      
          Health Costs                                                                                                          
          (both measured annually)                                                                                              
     Equals                                                                                                                     
     Surplus or (Unfunded Liability)                                                                                            
          Employer responsible for funding shortfall]                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
        ™This calculation is performed at the employer level as                                                                
          well as at the plan level                                                                                             
        ™There are concerns regarding employer level accounting                                                                
          and allocation methodologies in use                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
Ms. Morrison walked the Committee through the chart.                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
9:46:52 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
     Page 11                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
     Assets                                                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
     Employer contributions are accounted for in two separate                                                                   
     buckets:                                                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
        ™Active employer asset accounts                                                                                        
             o One account for each individual employer                                                                         
        ™Retiree reserve asset account                                                                                         
             o One consolidated account for all participating                                                                   
               employers                                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
Ms. Morrison overviewed the page,  commenting that there were 160                                                               
individual  employers  participating in  the  PERS  DB plan,  the                                                               
largest  of which  is the  State of  Alaska. The  retiree reserve                                                               
account  has  caused concerns  due  to  the  fact  that it  is  a                                                               
"consolidated"   account,  and   therefore   accounting  is   not                                                               
maintained at the employer level.                                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
9:47:48 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
     Page 12                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
     Retiree Reserve Account                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
     Funding Sources                                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
        ™Share of the plan's net investment income                                                                             
        ™Transfers from the active employer's asset accounts                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
Ms. Morrison read the page, noting that the lack of employer                                                                    
maintenance was an issue to be discussed in this presentation.                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
9:48:24 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
     Page 13                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
     Transfers                                                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
        ™In order to calculate an employer's past service                                                                      
          contribution rate, we assign retiree reserve assets to                                                                
          employers                                                                                                             
        ™Allocation process is used to assign retiree reserve                                                                  
          assets to individual employers                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
Ms. Morrison summarized the page.                                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
9:48:54 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
     Page 14                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
     Allocation Process                                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
     Allocate retiree reserve account balance to employers                                                                      
    resulting in employer's retiree reserve account balance                                                                     
        ™based on the employer's pro rata share of retiree                                                                     
          liabilities at year end                                                                                               
        ™The amount allocated to an employer does not represent                                                                
          contributions made by the employer                                                                                    
             o simply represents assets assigned                                                                                
        ™Concerns have been raised about this practice - no                                                                    
          accounting by individual employer.                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
Ms. Morrison reviewed the information on the page.                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
9:49:39 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
     Page 15                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
     Allocation example                                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
     Participating employer has the following assets and                                                                        
     liabilities in the Plan at 6/30/04.                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
     [Table depicting the following:                                                                                            
          Assets                                                                                                                
          Active: $237,819                                                                                                      
         Allocated share of retiree reserve account: -                                                                          
          Total: $237,819                                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
          Liabilities                                                                                                           
          Active: 350,172                                                                                                       
         Allocated share of retiree reserve account: -                                                                          
          Total: 350,172]                                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
        ™Unfunded liability is $112,353                                                                                        
        ™Employer has no retirees at 6/30/2004, so has not                                                                     
          contributed to the retiree reserve account                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
Ms. Morrison overviewed the example provided.                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
9:50:24 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
     Page 16                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
     Next year - FY05                                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
     Employer now has retirees in the  plan for the first time so                                                               
     will  get  an  allocation  of the  retiree  reserve  account                                                               
     balance  based  on  their retiree  liabilities  compared  to                                                               
     total  retiree   liabilities  even  though  they   have  not                                                               
    contributed to the retiree reserve account in the past.                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
Ms. Morrison continued with the example overview.                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
9:50:44 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
     Page 17                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
     The allocation                                                                                                             
     [Table depicting the following:                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
          Employer retiree liabilities:           $453,428                                                                      
          Total retiree liabilities          7,131,974,579                                                                      
          % allocated to employer                     .006%                                                                     
          Retiree reserve account balance    6,194,055,956                                                                      
          Account balance allocated to employer   $393,883                                                                      
          Even though employer has not contributed to this                                                                      
          account]                                                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
     Note: This is the impact if the employer's retiree                                                                         
     liabilities are growing; however, the reverse is the impact                                                                
     if the employer's retiree liability is declining.                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
Ms. Morrison summarized the page, stressing that the employer                                                                   
would receive a deduction to their retiree reserve balance if                                                                   
their retiree liabilities decreased rather than increased.                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
9:52:02 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
     Page 18                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
     Transfer                                                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
     AS   39.35.100   states,   "Upon  retirement,   the   amount                                                               
     actuarially  determined…to  fully   fund  benefits…shall  be                                                               
     transferred…from the employer  contribution account into the                                                               
     retirement reserve account."                                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
        ™Transfer, from the employer's active asset account,                                                                   
          the balance needed to fully fund the employer's                                                                       
          retiree reserve asset account                                                                                         
             o Compare the assigned assets to the allocated                                                                     
               liabilities and transfer the difference                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
Ms. Morrison reviewed the page.                                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
9:52:36 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
     Page 19                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
     The transfer                                                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
     Per statute, the retiree reserve account is to be fully                                                                    
     funded.                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
     [Table depicting the following:                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
          Employer retiree liabilities            $453,428                                                                      
          Account balance allocated to employer    393,883                                                                      
          Amount transferred from employer                                                                                      
               active account                      $59,545]                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
Ms. Morrison  read the information  on the page, adding  that the                                                               
employer  would  be  responsible  for  contributing  the  balance                                                               
necessary  after  the  transfer  to  fully  fund  its  retirement                                                               
obligations, as required by statute.                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
9:53:10 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
     Page 20                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
     Effect of allocation and transfer                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
     Participating employer has the following assets in the Plan                                                                
     at 6/30/05 after transfer to fully fund the retiree reserve                                                                
     account.                                                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
     [Table depicting the following:                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
     Assets:                                                                                                                    
     Active                                                                                                                     
     (237,819 + 32,261 - 59,545)                                                                                                
          $210,535                                                                                                              
     Allocated share of retiree reserve account                                                                                 
     (393,883 + 59,545)                                                                                                         
          453,428                                                                                                               
     Total                                                                                                                      
          $663,963                                                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
     Liabilities:                                                                                                               
     Active                                                                                                                     
     (237,819 + 32,261 - 59,545)                                                                                                
          $18,107                                                                                                               
     Allocated share of retiree reserve account                                                                                 
     (393,883 + 59,545)                                                                                                         
          453,428                                                                                                               
     Total                                                                                                                      
          $471,535]                                                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
        ™Over funded by $192,428.                                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
Ms.  Morrison  summarized  the exampled  calculation,  commenting                                                               
that,  as previously  mentioned,  the employer  could find  their                                                               
retirement   obligations   underfunded    if   their   retirement                                                               
liabilities were declining instead of increasing.                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
9:54:06 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
     Page 21                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
     Liabilities                                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
     Annually calculated by employee                                                                                            
        ™Allocated to individual employer                                                                                      
             o Based on pro rata service earned with employer                                                                   
             o Does not take into account salary earned with                                                                    
               employer                                                                                                         
             o Concerns have been raised about this allocation                                                                  
               process as well                                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
Ms. Morrison informed that an individual's liabilities are                                                                      
allocated to each employer if the employee had more than one                                                                    
participating employer.                                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
9:54:38 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
     Page 22                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
     Liability allocation example                                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
     One employee is a covered elected official for the City of                                                                 
     X for 5 years earning 5 years of service credit. Is paid                                                                   
     $1,000 for attending meeting during these 5 years.                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
     Same employee worked for City of Z for 5 years prior to                                                                    
     serving as elected official. Was paid $200,000 for the 5                                                                   
     year period.                                                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
Ms. Morrison read through the example.                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
9:55:08 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
     Page 23                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
     Example (cont.)                                                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
     Actuary calculates a $750,000 liability for the member.                                                                    
     This liability is allocated to employers as follows:                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
     [Table depicting the following:                                                                                            
          City of X                                                                                                             
          Salary Paid:             $1,000                                                                                       
          Service Earned:          5 yrs                                                                                        
          % by employee            50%                                                                                          
          Liability allocated      $375,000                                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
          City of Z                                                                                                             
          Salary Paid:             $200,000                                                                                     
          Service Earned:          5 yrs                                                                                        
          % by employee            50%                                                                                          
          Liability allocated      375,000                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
          Total                                                                                                                 
          Service Earned:          10 yrs                                                                                       
          % by employee            100%                                                                                         
          Liability allocated      $750,000]                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
     Note: Extreme example to clearly reflect the impact of the                                                                 
     current practice. Approximately 735 or 1.2% of all PERS                                                                    
     members have service in both categories shown above.                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
Ms. Morrison reviewed the example, noting that this calculation                                                                 
was the current practice.                                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
9:56:04 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
     Page 24                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
     Impact on Contribution Rates                                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
     Assets - Liabilities = Surplus or (Unfunded Liability)                                                                     
                                                                                                                                
     Concerns raised about both the assets and liabilities                                                                      
     assigned to employers, individually, and collectively,                                                                     
     impact the employer's unfunded liability.                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
     Unfunded liability - basis of the past service cost portion                                                                
     of the employer's contribution rate.                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
Ms. Morrison summarized the page.                                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
9:56:34 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
     Page 25                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
     Proposed Solution                                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
     Cost Share Legislation - long range                                                                                        
        ™Redesign the PERS DB plan - align with TRS                                                                            
             o All employers share the cost/income of the Plan                                                                  
               (benefits, administration, and investment)                                                                       
             o One uniform, less volatile, contribution rate                                                                    
        ™ARMB supports concept - Resolution 2007-04                                                                            
        ™AML supports concept                                                                                                  
        ™Administration of plan simplified                                                                                     
        ™Will be introduced by the Governor                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
Ms. Morrison reviewed the information.                                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
9:57:38 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
Senator Thomas  asked if the example  on page 23 was  the current                                                               
or proposed practice.                                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
Ms.  Morrison answered  that it  was  an example  of the  current                                                               
practice.                                                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
Senator Thomas asked how the  proposed solution would change that                                                               
calculation.                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
Ms. Morrison responded that all  employers would share equally in                                                               
the cost  of the  plan, and would  no longer  maintain individual                                                               
employer information.                                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
9:58:38 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
Senator Thomas  furthered, asking if annual  statements were sent                                                               
to employees.                                                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
Ms. Morrison affirmed, clarifying  that employees enrolled in the                                                               
defined  benefit  plan  receive   annual  statements,  and  those                                                               
enrolled  in the  defined  contribution  plan receive  statements                                                               
quarterly.                                                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
9:59:04 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
Senator Elton, referring to the  statutory requirements listed on                                                               
pages 8 and 9 and  "concerns raised" over employer contributions,                                                               
asked if ambiguity exists regarding liability accruals                                                                          
                                                                                                                                
9:59:58 AM                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
Ms.  Morrison replied  that the  liabilities are  known, as  that                                                               
figure is  calculated by  the member.  The "concerns"  regard the                                                               
assets,  as the  State  currently operates  under a  consolidated                                                               
retiree reserve  assets account  that does  not account  for each                                                               
employer's contributions.                                                                                                       
                                                                                                                                
10:00:16 AM                                                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
Senator  Elton  asked  if  the   current  practice  violates  the                                                               
statutory requirements.                                                                                                         
                                                                                                                                
10:00:29 AM                                                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
Ms.  Kreitzer  answered:  "I  don't   know  that  we've  been  in                                                               
contravention with  the statute. I  would say that this  has been                                                               
the practice of the State for  the last twenty years. I'm now the                                                               
Commissioner Designee  for the Department of  Administration; I'm                                                               
here to help you."                                                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
10:00:54 AM                                                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
Senator Elton continued,  speaking to the proposed  solution of a                                                               
"65/35" cost  share of retirement  obligations between  the State                                                               
and municipalities.  He was  aware of  other proposed  cost share                                                               
ratios, and  asked how  flexible the  Administration would  be to                                                               
amending that figure.                                                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
Ms. Kreitzer suggested the Department  present the entire plan to                                                               
the Committee before discussing the cost share ratio.                                                                           
                                                                                                                                
10:02:14 AM                                                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
Co-Chair Hoffman  asked the proposed  implementation date  of the                                                               
legislation.                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
Ms. Kreitzer set the effective date as July 1, 2007.                                                                            
                                                                                                                                
Co-Chair  Hoffman asked  how the  calculations would  address the                                                               
long-term unfunded liability.                                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
Ms.  Kreitzer  was  not  prepared to  answer  the  question,  and                                                               
anticipated that  discussion beginning  with the  introduction of                                                               
the cost share legislation. She  would present the Committee with                                                               
a  "long-term   vision"  that  could   include  a   General  Fund                                                               
"infusion"  into  the  retirement system,  and  possibly  pension                                                               
obligation  bonds. The  Administration anticipated  addressing 80                                                               
percent of the unfunded liability.                                                                                              
                                                                                                                                
Co-Chair   Hoffman  asked   if  participation   bonds  would   be                                                               
introduced as separate legislation.                                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
10:03:41 AM                                                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
Ms. Kreitzer informed that House  Bill 13 had been introduced and                                                               
that  bill spoke  to the  bonding issue.  It would  allow pension                                                               
obligation  bonds if  passed by  the legislature.  The Department                                                               
would present  additional information  regarding the  bond option                                                               
at a later date.                                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
10:04:34 AM                                                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
Senator  Huggins  asked  if   the  municipalities  supported  the                                                               
legislation.                                                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
Ms. Kreitzer  had heard presentations  from the  Alaska Municipal                                                               
League (AML),  and had  spoken to a  few members.  The Department                                                               
had taken  public comments into consideration  while drafting the                                                               
legislation, and would meet formally with AML.                                                                                  
                                                                                                                                
Senator  Huggins  asked the  reaction  of  AML  thus far  in  the                                                               
process.                                                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
10:05:17 AM                                                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
Ms.  Kreitzer responded  that AML  members  had not  yet taken  a                                                               
position, as  the Administration had  not had the  opportunity to                                                               
present the complete plan.                                                                                                      
                                                                                                                                
10:05:40 AM                                                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
Co-Chair  Stedman identified  three  issues  the Committee  would                                                               
address in the coming months. The  first was a "clean-up" bill to                                                               
Senate  Bill 141,  retirement system  legislation  passed by  the                                                               
24th Legislature. The second issue  would be the cost share bill,                                                               
and the third  issue would be addressing  the unfunded liability.                                                               
He anticipated the "clean-up" bill  and the cost share bill would                                                               
be before the Committee in the coming weeks.                                                                                    
                                                                                                                                
10:06:54 AM                                                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
Senator  Thomas asked  the Department's  position on  the use  of                                                               
obligation bonds.                                                                                                               
                                                                                                                                
10:07:17 AM                                                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
Ms.  Kreitzer  replied  that the  Department  would  present  the                                                               
effects of  using pension obligation  bonds to address  a portion                                                               
of  the unfunded  liability, focusing  on  the long-term  savings                                                               
that would provide.                                                                                                             
                                                                                                                                
Senator Thomas queried if that discussion would include tax                                                                     
exempt bonds.                                                                                                                   
                                                                                                                                
Ms. Kreitzer  responded that the  Department had  concentrated on                                                               
pension obligation  bonds. She looked  forward to the  cost share                                                               
bill serving  as a  "vehicle" to  examine possible  solutions for                                                               
the unfunded liability facing the State.                                                                                        
                                                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                
ADJOURNMENT                                                                                                                 
                                                                                                                                
Co-Chair Bert Stedman adjourned the meeting at 10:08:46 AM                                                                    

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